SignalTraffic Forums

That is awesome! I remember seeing an advertisement in the IMSA Journal a couple of months back advertising Cobalt as the "Next Big Thing", but never bothered to investigate it more.

It is cool to see that the traffic industry is beginning to progress into the world of GUIs and mobile device integration. This stuff is beginning to make the controllers of the past decade look ancient!

Got to see the Cobalt at the IMSA Florida conference yesterday...really impressive controller. The remote interface (tablet) which duplicates the front panel is neat.

Also was looking at the Centrax software...several installations in the works here in Florida.

Nick finally realized the truth and wants to come over to the Econolite side of the fence.

sorphin wrote:Nick finally realized the truth and wants to come over to the Econolite side of the fence.

More like Econolite has finally come out with something worth getting!



I still like the X2 over Cobalt. But if its got a color touch screen with graphic interface...and controls a traffic signal... well thats pretty darn !!

EPAC-EPIC-MARC wrote: But if its got a color touch screen with graphic interface...and controls a traffic signal... well thats pretty darn !!

...mebbe I'm just being a curmudgeon this morning, but anyway..., why do I STILL find it next-to-impossible to believe that any of these whiz-bang 'color touch screen with angry-birds interface' machines will EVER last as long as motors, solenoids, gears, and relays...??

And when they DO ultimately fail, there ain't NOTHIN' to FIX -- just throw the whole thing in the landfill and get another "new-and-improved" one. (which probably won't plug into any of the old wires, since it'll have been 'upgraded' so much since the dead one was made 4 years ago...)

IF NOTHING ELSE, what are we collectors gonna have left to collect in another 40 yrs??? Piles of shiny little aluminum boxes full of fried microchips that all used to do something...??? That just doesn't sound like very much fun, to me...?

No offense... for the price of these things they aren't disposable, and I'm sure they have been very well tested to last.

What may happen is now Econo has created a software upgradeable controller, so now less will be swapped out, but rather flashed with the update for the new features.

It amazes me every time someone gripes about advances in tech ruining society ON AN INTERNET FORUM! The advance in Tech allowed you to gripe, didn't it??

BigTbird1974 wrote:

EPAC-EPIC-MARC wrote: But if its got a color touch screen with graphic interface...and controls a traffic signal... well thats pretty darn !!

...mebbe I'm just being a curmudgeon this morning, but anyway..., why do I STILL find it next-to-impossible to believe that any of these whiz-bang 'color touch screen with angry-birds interface' machines will EVER last as long as motors, solenoids, gears, and relays...??

And when they DO ultimately fail, there ain't NOTHIN' to FIX -- just throw the whole thing in the landfill and get another "new-and-improved" one. (which probably won't plug into any of the old wires, since it'll have been 'upgraded' so much since the dead one was made 4 years ago...)

IF NOTHING ELSE, what are we collectors gonna have left to collect in another 40 yrs??? Piles of shiny little aluminum boxes full of fried microchips that all used to do something...??? That just doesn't sound like very much fun, to me...?

Well there are people here that prefer the new stuff over the old stuff. I'll take a color touch screen over anything mechanical anyday. If they get damaged you can fix them if you have the right knowledge and tools. Jeff and I fixed a damaged EPIC140 with an EPROM burner. Mechanicals are no doubt easier to troubleshoot but its not impossible to troubleshoot new stuff. I've done it myself by reading manuals, schematics and learning from people.

And yes I would like a controller that does "Angry Birds" (even though I mentioned multiple times that it was installed at a trade show and not something that would be in the field) because it can and has the power to do all sorts of cool functions not the least is an easier user interface, programming from a web browser and streaming video from detection cameras. Mechanicals switched lights, but not much else and thats boring to me.

I have this interest because I like the new technologies. Not so much the old. If that makes me the outcast then so be it. I enjoy my shiny metal box of all the latest and greatest gizmos.



I'm sorry if I got a little heated but this isn't the first time I've heard "new stuff will just be scrapped, lets keep all the old stuff" If I was to say the opposite and we should junk all the old stuff I know I'd be laughed out of the group. So please, lets have a little respect for the people who actually like and know how to work/fix the new stuff and just because you don't know how to troubleshoot it when it fails doesnt mean its off to the landfill. We have 30+ year old electronic controllers in service here still kicking away when the last of the mechanicals are jamming and require an annual (or more) maintenance.

EPAC-EPIC-MARC wrote:So please, lets have a little respect for the people who actually like and know how to work/fix the new stuff and just because you don't know how to troubleshoot it when it fails doesnt mean its off to the landfill. We have 30+ year old electronic controllers in service here still kicking away when the last of the mechanicals are jamming and require an annual (or more) maintenance.

Unfortunately Nick, there are some counties (mine, unfortunately) that have developed the not fix anything policies.. At one point in time, they even did circuit board work, now they've turned their techs (including Willie) into just controller swappers, no actual repair/troubleshooting anymore.

sorphin wrote:

EPAC-EPIC-MARC wrote:So please, lets have a little respect for the people who actually like and know how to work/fix the new stuff and just because you don't know how to troubleshoot it when it fails doesnt mean its off to the landfill. We have 30+ year old electronic controllers in service here still kicking away when the last of the mechanicals are jamming and require an annual (or more) maintenance.

Unfortunately Nick, there are some counties (mine, unfortunately) that have developed the not fix anything policies.. At one point in time, they even did circuit board work, now they've turned their techs (including Willie) into just controller swappers, no actual repair/troubleshooting anymore.

Agreed that not every municipality handles it the same way. Here I've been told they retain much of their controller equipment for swap outs. If a controller needs to be serviced, a spare unit goes in and the existing unit goes back to the shop for repairs. These can include any software upgrade unable to do in the field, physical problems like a bad screen or power supply, etc. Controllers can and will be frankensteined around here...pulling a power supply from a spare controller and putting it into a controller to go out into the field. When the issues are resolved the intersection controller goes back in as there is a record of what controller goes with which intersection here in Macomb County.

Stuff that is beyond repair, lightning strikes and car accidents are usually trashed, also equipment that no longer has parts or support from the manufacturer. In the case of Siemens, EPIC140 and EPAC300 were both discontinued as physical controller units. Siemens is supporting EPAC but no longer supporting EPIC. From what I was told you can no longer get parts brand new like front panels and stuff for EPICs. This makes having spares all the more important.

Now then comes the time for a system upgrade like the one we are currently under..NEMA to ITS.. many of the older controllers are still saved for backups but some can and will make it down to the collector market in working order; not always "metal boxes of fried microchips". That is how I've gotten most of my stuff all in working order from various sources and installed myself into my own cabinet. Total upgrades out in the field caused the stuff I have to make it into my hands. Some of what I have is less than 6 years old...but thats actually a long time considering how fast technology has changed in recent years, not just in the traffic signal industry! Think of how we have new cell phones every year or two!

Also as collectors there is this mentality that NEMA stuff is the state of the art. It really isn't that new. Tried and true NEMA TS-1 is closing in at 40 years old, and the fancier and advanced TS-2 is a 20 year old spec. Granted there have been modifications over time but the base spec is pretty old. ITS and 2070 are the new kids on the block which have much more features as well as a standard for component size and shape.

Also remember, the system upgrades from 2 decades ago caused the flood of mechanicals to get into the collector market. Some worked and some needed work.

No one said that all you'd get with retired mechanical controllers were metal boxes of rusty corroded gears and jammed springs! Same goes for the new stuff you get good working stuff mixed in with the broken stuff.